Quad anchor vs sliding x forum. If your gear is bomber, go for it.
Quad anchor vs sliding x forum. I recently started climbing outdoors. Sep 6, 2024 · In 2017 I started calling a material efficient version of the Quad anchor a “Mini-Quad”. Personally, The sliding X is fine on two solid bolts, but then again, if both bolts are solid, why bother with a sliding X? You could use two long quick draws, a quad anchor, a masterpoint anchor, etc. May 11, 2019 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. Toprope How to build: Multipitch How to build: Advantages Disadvantages Alternative Anchors Through the rings Girth hitch Master + MP variation 1 carabiner Girth hitch rings var 1 carabiner Notes Carabiner orientation Carabiner types Hitches Attended vs Moved PermanentlyThe document has moved here. I was going through anchoring techniques and I came across this well-received question: Anchor without cordelette? How should one decide when to go for a Cordelette or an Equalette? Jul 27, 2025 · Anchors: No extension vs. I'm thinking of using one for single pitch sport routes that have two horizontal bolts at the end. The usual way of clipping a sliding-X is to put a single twist in one of the strands, then clip both. Backing up a sliding x and other equalized anchors. Opinions? 2) It can be difficult to clip another carabiner into the main point of a sliding-X when it is weighted. quad, sliding x, etc. You can find this anchor in almost any modern anchors book. There are many ways to set up a top rope anchor and this article covers 7 of them. With an anchor setup on a sport climb, you can freely top rope the route (after leading it) or take multiple laps on lead. This study explored the effects of sliding and fixed length Also tests have shown that even a percectly equalised sliding x system does not fully equalise the load simply becuase of the tensions involved. Step 1 The quad is one of the most discussed things on forums like this, and yet I almost never see them tied on actual rock. Aug 1, 2014 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. In theory, loading the pocket of the quad should result in an equal load to each anchor point, which would thereby reduce the likelihood of potential failure of either anchor point on its own. To ensure effective distribution at both distribution points (50/25/25% load distribution), the anchor builder would have to create a composite anchor with a second quad or sliding X at the second distribution point. Sliding X vs BFK is mostly sewn-sling-centric but you can grab about 8-12 meters of a 6mm or 7mm accessory cord and now you have the flexibility to create any type of anchor. Additionally, if you use a quad then the other leg is isolated, in a master point as well, and even a sliding X i will usually clove one of the legs so nothing bad happens if a rock falls and slices a leg. Dec 1, 2023 · The idea behind sport climbing anchors is relatively simple. Aug 4, 2021 · The quad anchor is a popular choice, but usually requires a 180 cm doubled sling or bulky cordelette. In constructing a multi-point anchor, climbers may generally elect a sliding or fixed length rigging system, resulting in a classic tradeoff between extension and load distribution, respectively. In practice, this is not the case. The sliding-x is a self-equalizing anchor which distributes the load equally between the anchor pieces. . PRE-EQUALIZED Aug 4, 2021 · The quad anchor is a popular choice, but usually requires a 180 cm doubled sling or bulky cordelette. To limit the extension, tie overhand knots just above the clip-in point. However I've seen people make their anchor many other different ways. Oct 7, 2016 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. Just use a sling or two, or a quad, or a cordelette, or an equalette, or a couple sliding X'swhatever floats yer boat. Moved PermanentlyThe document has moved here. This technique works well when anchor points are not perfectly aligned. In some contexts, the bolts on sport climbs are quipped with permanent draws you can use for an anchor. There are several pre-equalized and self-equalizing techniques to choose from, including the sliding-X, the equalette, and the quad anchor. The Quad does work well at a two bolt stance where one climber clips to two strands and the second climber clips to the other two strands. Reply reply Tom0laSFW • The following anchors can be tied with variations of the overhand knot: Method 1: Limited sliding X Method 2: BFK Method 3: Quad Anchor The other episodes we referenced American Death Triangles The simplest set-up that would get you through 90% of routes with bolted anchors is a 48-inch runner with 4 locking biners (one each for the bolts and two opposing for the rope) in a non-extending sliding-x. An anchor refers to the whole system — the anchor points, the protection gear, runners, carabiners and climbing rope. Dec 10, 2023 · Equalization is the process of distributing the load evenly among the anchor points to prevent any one piece from bearing an excessive amount of weight. ). I used to just use 2 quickdraws but I was reading Apr 27, 2016 · Question, do people use the Sliding X anchor and if so in what situation, I. Should an anchor Aug 6, 2015 · The equalette is the evolution and combination of the cordalette and sliding-x. An additional and in my opinion slightly better anchor for 2 bolts is the quad. However you do it, make sure that if any piece failed, the resulting anchor shift: - Is minimal - Causes the remaining pieces to re-equalize - Will not cause you to lose control of the belay The following arrangement uses one double-length sling to equalize three pieces. You're still through the loop in the event on end rips, but you have both strands to hold the force when they both hold. I don't care much about the bulky issue, I want something thst is quick and safe. my question is should i get cordelette or a dyneema sling? i’ve Feb 1, 2021 · Floating anchor: but what if the anchor blows? Isn't it going to rip the other anchor out? I hear this as a common statement when discussing a two-point floating anchor (aka self-equalising, equalette, magic X, sliding X, quad, etc. Jun 7, 2024 · The quad anchor rig offers fast set up, great strength, good load distribution and complete redundancy, all in a light, compact package. Feb 2, 2025 · Types and Methods of Self-Equalizing Anchor Sliding-X Method This is a simple way of creating a self-equalizing anchor wherein it connects two anchor points that adjust depending on the direction of the pull. Been seeing a lot of post on Instagram about using girth hitch at master point. The sliding system also carries with it the risk of “extension” upon failure of an anchor point. It can be better than other methods of equalizing in certain situations. But even that is not fully equalized If more than 2 pieces due to friction. Aug 16, 2021 · First time multi-pitching? Not sure how to build an anchor? Check out this ultimate guide to get you started in the right direction! Jun 30, 2023 · Anchors that self-adjust, like quad and sliding X configurations, do not eliminate extension. I’ve never seen this before and was never this. ” The quad is currently the best technique for building self-distributing anchors. The Quad was an attempt to overcome that limitation. I was shown to make a self-equalizing anchor (with the x) using a sling and 4 locking carabiners, and have done that since. jg The sliding x with limiter knots allows for equalization, while the figure 8 anchor is pre equalized when you can accurately judge where the second climber is coming up from, as long as the route doesn’t wander. The Quad fulfills these requirements of a good anchor: 1) It is automatically equalized (as long as the two anchor points "We did a lot of testing with Sterling and found that binding was a bigger factor than first suspected, especially with sliding X, where a sling is basically hitched around the biner, less so on somethng like a quad, where anchor point biners are clipped though a comparatively wide loopMost of the elaborate rigging systems are of little use Jul 7, 2016 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. It makes up for the short comings of each system, while incorporating their strengths to produce a more SRENE anchor. Jan 1, 2015 · When you need an anchor that allows for a change of direction in the climb, while remaining equalized. i’m relatively new to outdoor climbing & am wanting to build a quad anchor of my own pretty much just to set up top rope with, and a quad anchor because it’s what i’ve used so far climbing with others so i just understand how to make it the most. That's a backed up sliding x. Create a sliding X by forming a loop with the climbing rope and attaching each strand to separate anchor points. Advantages Disadvantages Quad The sliding X is another common anchor you might see. Here’s a great way to build a bomber quad anchor on three pieces of trad gear. Adjust the length of each strand to achieve equalization. Oct 22, 2017 · Any issues with using a (nylon or dyneema) double-length sling (sliding x with limiters) for a two-bolt anchor, either on TR (where there's no issue with rope or biners running over an edge, so no static line build needed)? I usually use a quad or a sliding x with limiters made from 7 mm cord, but the slings are more compact, and I'm curious. **Parts of this post are missing/non-functional due to my stupidity, sorry!** This led me to think; why don’t I find the smartest, most experienced climber and simply do what they do? So I looked in highly regarded books, referenced anchor research, and read the opinions of experts in the fields of climbing and climbing physics. However, the general While a quad can split a load fairly evenly between two arms, a sliding X might only achieve a 70/30 split since the twist in the sling at the master point creates friction which puts most of the load on one of the two arms. The problem with a sliding x is that if one point fails, the sling extends and shock loads the anchor. The individual bolt backups prevent extension and provide redundancy for the sliding-x, which otherwise is a single point of failure. May 19, 2021 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. If you want something bomb-proof, go with a 20-30 foot cordlette with a double fisherman's knot in a quad anchor. Sep 1, 2008 · 2) If your anchor is anything but two side-by-side bolts, Gaines and Long recommend the "equalette" (basically the same configuration as the quad but not doubled - so you have one loop - knot - two strands - knot - one loop). Do any of you guys double up your anchors like that? I was also thinking of using one dyneema sling and one nylon. the anchor stays equalised even if the load moves around. e. There are many ways of incorporating the sliding-X into an anchor. However, the cordelette may seem more intuitive to beginners in a 3 placement situation. If your gear is bomber, go for it. This blog post is intended to supplement our Three-Piece Anchors video, in which we demonstrate three different three-piece anchor configurations: what we call the “W,” the “V-Clove,” and the “Quad. A much better alternative is to use the quad anchor. Jun 12, 2021 · When you use a sliding x anchor, do you use limiter knots on the legs to reduce shock load potential? If so how close together do you tie them? Obviously the closer they are, the less self equalizing, but it seems safer if one of the pieces blow. I was practicing my sliding x's and wondered if there were any cons to doubling it up, as in clipping into two sliding x's. The goal is to combine the bolts at the top of the pitch into a single anchor system. This can be solved by adding "limiter knots" approximately 6" from either side of the sliding X's main point. This was built from a 120cm, or double length, Dyneema runner with two overhand knots that became welded and… Called the "Quad" and is supposed to be best compromise between equalization and non-extension. See this video on how to build a sliding-x. Mar 13, 2016 · I wasn't considering using the quad for more than two point anchors, but now that it has been pointed out I can see where the longer cordellette material would have an advantage. To make this: First, carabiners should be connected to one sling at each anchor point. In this episode, Mike goes over three examples of a sliding X anchor using Dyneema slings. That being said, if you’ve got rope to spare for anchor building you certainly gain a lot of ease in connecting pieces (don’t have to fiddle with making static arms and other weird configurations). The sliding-x anchor offers auto Nov 12, 2021 · The purpose of the quad is to have dual sliding/variable masterpoints. If you have any recommendations for any other types of sliding X anchors, please let us know in the comments. Mar 3, 2025 · The “quad” offers a strong, fast, redundant, simple anchor when distributing forces between pieces is a high priority. This study explored the effects of sliding and fixed length rigging in anchors experiencing failure of an anchor component. For example, with 2 slings instead of 1, with a cordette in a quad instead of a sling, or just 2 quickdraws (is the lase one somehow unsafe?) I'm curious about Jan 27, 2018 · to add, basically the closest thing to a fully equalized anchor is to always connect two pieces/parts-of-the-anchor together with sliding x’s. Clip the sling into two bolts. The sliding X anchor does not satisfy the No Extension part of the SERENE anchor test. Lately there has been a decline in its popularity primarily due to the recognition of the hazards of anchor extension, discussed below. What’re your thoughts on this? Apr 13, 2020 · Want to learn how to build climbing anchors? This introduction covers important concepts such as SERENE-SA to get you started in the right direction. Feb 9, 2020 · The advantage of this method is that the master point self-equalises, regardless of the direction of pull on the anchor. Agreed non extension is far more important, especially with dyneema anchor. But using your rope or PAS as the anchor is NG if you're leading in blocks, or worried about escaping the belay in a crisis. A Quad, basically, is a pre-built system of some cord and a few biners that will help you address many of the points mentioned above in a timely manner. Apr 18, 2017 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. I have been using the "sliding X" and "equalette" anchor systems but am looking to invest in a cordelette to build a quad anchor with for extended periods of top roping. Jul 6, 2020 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. I can only think it’s based on the assumption you have: Built or chosen poor anchors Rigged the anchors together in a way that does not share the load between The quad is already an over engineered anchor and you could build an equally strong master point or clove hitch anchor with half the cord and faster adjustability. By using a quad in sliding X fashion you are defeating the purpose. "We did a lot of testing with Sterling and found that binding was a bigger factor than first suspected, especially with sliding X, where a sling is basically hitched around the biner, less so on somethng like a quad, where anchor point biners are clipped though a comparatively wide loop. If you must do so, make sure you have clipped the carabiner through the sling in exactly the same way as the original carabiner. Mathematical data suggest the potential shock loads created by extension (even limited and minimized extensions) can be severe. Feb 16, 2019 · Very rarely have I made it work on a 3-piece trad anchor - by clipping one end of the quad into 2 pieces that are equalized on a sliding-x and the other end into my 3rd piece. if I needed the anchor to hang lower, I would (as you suggest) untie the "Quad" and rig something else that hangs lower. e as protection on the lead or as a belay anchor ? The 'Quad Anchor' is an anchor system which self-adjusts to keep an equal force on each anchor point. There are lots of different ways to set up a top-rope anchor, including a sliding X, an equalized cordelette or two quickdraws with gates opposite and opposed. In the normal course of events, only the sliding-x is loaded, providing a nominally equalized anchor. Would be fine for two bomber bolts (nothing else) but save yourself untying the knots after they’re weighted and just use the sliding x, or better yet two draws. Things then get even more complicated when you use a quad to create a 3-point anchor, as the load is split not once but In theory, loading the pocket of the quad should result in an equal load to each anchor point, which would thereby reduce the likelihood of potential failure of either anchor point on its own. It's actually very safe and has the added benefit of dynamic equalisation I. Learn all about it here. Walker is back! On this beautiful #walkerwednesday. A drawback to the sliding X is that if one anchor point fails, there will be significant extension that will shock load the other anchor point. No one-size-fits all in either climbing style (blocks vs swing) or anchor building (slings vs rope). equalization - SuperTopo's climbing discussion forum is the world's most popular community discussion forum for people who actively climb outdoors. (I should add that just two pieces of pro are almost never "good enough;" and when I would use a sliding-x, I'm actually using a Trango Alpine Equalizer, which is essentially a pre-rigged sliding-x The sliding-x anchor is a quick and easy anchor to build. This article explains how it can be used to rig two and three-piece anchors. Yeah this isn’t really any safer than a plain sliding x because the knots aren’t limiting extension, and is actually weaker because of the knots in the material. The anchor in a recreational climbing system must be unquestionably strong and secure, able to withstand the force of high factor falls. This anchor utilizes the "Sliding X" and knots on either side to eliminate extensions. OP probably was taught the quad, feels comfortable with it, and might be unaware of different rigging methods. Jul 2, 2018 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. Given the worst-case scenario for each anchor type (partial anchor failure resulting in extension for Sliding X, off-axis loading resulting in zippering of pieces in a Cordelette), as well as identical theoretical anchors and forces for each comparable setup, which is stronger? Jun 22, 2021 · I've collected some of my thoughts and comments from those threads and put them in this explainer to shed some light on the risks associated with sliding rigging systems (i. Oct 29, 2023 · ok, i know this topic has been done to death but i just need simple answers. Jun 30, 2008 · When the sliding-x is good enough, I'll use it, because often speed and simplicity of set-up is almost as important as having a bomb-proof anchor. In keeping with prior research, the results indicate that the extension endemic in sliding anchor systems increases peak forces on the remaining anchor component relative to fixed length systems. This study explored the effects of sliding and fixed length Moved PermanentlyThe document has moved here. This is a great substitution for the sliding X and is our go to trad anchor when the master point needs to move and equalize. Its biggest advantage is the ability to quickly and easily equalize (which means the weight/load is equally distributed across all points of the anchor). In constructing a multi-point anchor, climbers may generally elect a sliding or fixed length rigging system, resulting in a classic tradeoff between extension and load dist ribution, respectively. Sep 23, 2014 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. Feb 26, 2018 · Understanding how to work a third placement into the quad matrix will be a snap for an experienced anchor builder with several tools in the toolbox. Equalizing anchors is important because. Pull the two loops downward between the bolts and in the intended direction of pull (direction of the climber). The disadvantage is, in the unlikely event of an anchor point failing, the sling will lengthen and shock-load the other anchor point. It is essentially a double loop of cord, with two overhand knots along the way and with a locking carabiner on each end. I used to carry a pre-tied quad for bolted anchors in Squamish, but even that felt like overkill. Jun 1, 2019 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. If you are connected to one of the masterpoints, the maximum extension is the remaining distance within the masterpoint (limited, but present extension and shock load). One of the criticisms of the cordalette is after you've tied the master knot, you have potentially poor equalization if you deviate from your set direction of pull. Jul 15, 2020 · The Sliding-X anchor has historically been a popular anchor in the climbing community as well as seeing limited use in the rescue community. The purpose is to set up a top rope for the other climbers after a lead. Should an anchor point fail, the result is that the load in the Oct 15, 2022 · Find rock climbing routes, photos, and guides for every state, along with experiences and advice from fellow climbers. I've done a lot of googling but most threads on quad anchors focus on when not to use them. This has been known since at least 1984. Useful if you are headpointing a route that wanders. In practice, this is not the case (see Club Alpino Italiano, 2006 as one example). What if you don't have that gear with you? Here's an alternative: Simply use a pair of 120 cm slings. The rope is nylon and the cord is nylon, a lot of stretch to take the peak force down. Feb 1, 2024 · This is crucial for preventing individual pieces from failing and compromising the entire anchor. Understanding how to optimally distribute loads between the pieces that comprise the anchor, which frequently vary in inherent strength and placement quality, is a really important skill that people shouldn't ignore because they learned that equalization is impossible. dtnudgcjeabapsjxwstkonpsxthpkqztcvhzpkecdtscrgqgi